Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Welcome to AllView360 all things real Estate Podcast. With your hosts Daniel Gutierrez and Shannon Dempsey, we explore real estate from every angle, giving you insights, tools and confidence to make smart decisions that support your future. It's time for a new perspective on Property. Welcome to AllView360.
We have Ray today.
[00:00:21] Speaker B: Hey, y'. All.
[00:00:22] Speaker A: I'm very excited. So today we're going to be talking about team structures, kind of different brokerage structures, but specifically focused on teams. And I'm very excited to have Ray join us. He's been incredible over the years. These are the two guys that I talk to on a regular basis about all things real estate and growing and how to grow in different perspectives.
So, Ray, do you want me to awkwardly talk about you for a second?
[00:00:47] Speaker B: It's a lot less awkward if you do it than having me do it.
[00:00:50] Speaker A: This is true.
So, Ray Frazier, owner of Coastline down in Bay Park, San Diego, right there along the coast. But he has built a strong reputation in San Diego real estate not just as a producing agent, but someone that really understands team building, agent growth and brokerage dynamics. Your earlier career was director of growth expansion for one of the top performing real estate teams, which you corrected me, the top performing real estate team and
[00:01:19] Speaker B: number one in California.
[00:01:20] Speaker A: Number one in California.
Recruiting agents, building infrastructure and scale high volume operations. And then recently you launched Coastline, which has been very exciting to see you do. I went to the launch party that you had, the big grand opening of your office, which was incredible. And it stood out to me how respected you are within the industry at that event specifically. Everyone was so honored to be there, happy to be there, excited for you and your family.
So am I missing anything that you want to share about your background?
[00:01:52] Speaker B: That's more than enough. Thank you so much for the wonderful introduction. It's always, I feel like, weird talking about yourself. That's like anybody, right? So I personally love it.
[00:02:02] Speaker A: Fair enough.
[00:02:03] Speaker B: As real estate agents, I feel like we should like it more.
[00:02:06] Speaker A: Yeah, but we don't. So, Ray, you are a wealth of knowledge in so many topics, but specifically this one. When we had spoke about different structures, I think earlier in the year, I was kind of blown away at your different perspectives on it. So I thought we could start with maybe what a team is in general or the, I don't want to say Taboo team, but kind of people think real estate team and they imagine this, but there really is so many different versions of it. So what, what's your first impression of when someone says real estate team? I want to Have a team. I want to be on a team. What does that look like?
[00:02:40] Speaker B: So many things. And I'm really passionate about this subject because I've been a part of teams, some of them not successful. I've been a part of teams that were literally like the most successful in the state. And I've built my own different iteration of teams. And so I'm not one that says like, hey, I'm going to mandate what a team is like. If you call yourself a team, by all means, give it a shot. But I do think that there's a reason that most teams fail, and it's because they don't understand what building a team or structuring a team really entails. I think you have to have a unified set of systems, a unified branding structure and a unified culture that allows you to go really position yourself as a successful team and as an authority in the industry for the people that you're trying to get into business with. And so I know there's a lot of teams in the industry right now. I think it's certainly a sexy thing to go out and try to build and it's a fun adventure for a lot of people. But I know that a lot of those teams are not successful, they're not achieving the goals that they want and it's because they're lacking. I think a lot of those things, the systemization, the branding, the culture, it's
[00:03:46] Speaker C: like running a business. And I think another, another thing we see a lot now or hear a lot is a group instead of the team. We now see this group.
[00:03:55] Speaker A: Hey, I'm using group.
[00:03:57] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:03:58] Speaker A: Do we, do we like group or we don't like group? Should I change everything I'm doing?
[00:04:01] Speaker C: I like it.
[00:04:02] Speaker B: I think it's interesting.
Like, what's the difference? You know what I mean? Is there a difference? And I think certain, like when you look at awards, right, real trend says if you're this many agents, you're a team, but if you're this many agen agents, you're now a group. And so I personally don't know what the, the threshold is that allows you to graduate from a team to a group. I think a lot of it just kind of comes down to branding and I think branding in a social media driven world is really, really important. So whatever you're going to go lean into, just lean all into it. We call ourselves the Coastline Real Estate Group. What's interesting, and I had an aha not too long ago, is that we are actually trying to position ourselves less as a Real estate group or team and more as an agent platform. And I think there's a huge difference there. When you look at some of the largest entities in the industry and Daniel, I'm looking at like place, right, that is not necessarily a team. It's a platform of agents that are utilizing a unified brand, a unified culture and a unified set of systems that, and they've blown up. And so we're, we're looking at our structure now and trying to identify how do we go from being, you know, a traditional real estate team slash group into more of an agent focused growth platform that allows us to go attract and help more agents.
[00:05:26] Speaker C: So there's a lot to unpack there. Right. And I think something we, going back to the beginning part of what you were saying, I think we used to hear team a lot more and hearing group a lot more now, especially the last few years. But what you're saying is spot on. I think one of the biggest values that a team, a group, a brokerage, whatever could provide to agents is that structure, structure to help them succeed. And agents are, you know, they're here to get clients, help their clients, transact, be that resource. A lot of them don't have the ability, time, desire to want to build all of those processes. And oftentimes that's two different sides of the brain, two different skill sets. Providing that as a team, lead, as a group, as a brokerage, I think is one of the biggest values that you could provide your agents and ultimately help in their success, which leads to the success of the team, the group, the brokerage.
[00:06:17] Speaker B: I couldn't agree more. I think it's funny, when you say the word team, there's a certain image that comes to mind when you say the word platform. It's a very different image, it's a very different thought process. And yet I think more teams should have a platform that their agents can plug into. And so I really like that verbiage because I think it speaks to how important the systemization is to being able to build out a group or a team in a way that is scalable and profitable. I think that's one of the biggest things that we see across the industry. Oh, I've got a team of five, 10 agents, but I don't make any money.
I'm in the red every month. And it's because they're lacking a platform that allows them to go build a
[00:07:01] Speaker A: true business team to me insinuates that there's a coach, there's no rookies, there's MVPs it's all different levels of experience and skill sets on the team versus group, which for me is how I wanted to go. It is we have a group mentality, we all do this particular job this way and we have shared mindsets, shared goals, shared approaches. And that's my focus with what I plan to do is a group of like minded agents that do things at a certain quality the same way. And so to me that was the big difference between going the team route or the group route. From a branding perspective, that's interesting.
[00:07:42] Speaker B: So you're saying like the way you define group is more of like a collective of like minded people coming together. A team maybe has a little bit more of like a structured org chart. Is that kind of how you're. I think that makes a lot of sense. And when I think of like what I, what I picture, when I picture a group versus a team, I think that plays a lot that's really valid.
[00:08:05] Speaker A: And then it's all just what you want to do, right? And then what aligns with that to
[00:08:09] Speaker C: both your points and you just touched on it. Again Shannon, it's, you know, how do you define success? And Ray, you touched that at the beginning. You know, some of the largest, most successful teams. What does success look like when you talk to different people?
That's totally different. I think the most normal benchmark would be transaction volume, number of sales, price, things like that. But everyone has a completely different idea of what success is for them. Like we had a call with our team, our agents, end of last year, beginning of this year of setting their goals and how they're going to achieve them. Speaking with Shannon, one of her goals was a component of production, but one of her other goals was a personal goal. So it's like how do you reach that level of production without having to kill yourself or just be so busy that you can't achieve your other personal goals. So there's the agents who, you know, they do massive volume in regards to dollar price but they don't do that many transactions and they limit themselves saying, hey, I'm going to work 10 hours a week but I'm still going to close, you know, $100 million a year because they only work with those high end clients. So the, the idea of success I think varies and we need to really acknowledge that in this conversation to determine, you know, it might be a little bit different for everybody. And it's super important when building the group, the team, the platform of who do you want, who do you want to work with and how do you provide that value that they're looking for?
[00:09:34] Speaker B: It goes to like, I have conversations, as I'm sure you both do, with a lot of agents and they're like, I never want to start a team and it's because they don't want to like babysit people. And I, I totally get that. When it comes to how do you define success, what are your goals? And it's super different. I think anybody that does want to start a team really just needs a better understanding of what they're getting into it. It goes from a solo entrepreneur, I'm going to go just be the hero and shoulder this mindset to I need to have a systemized, leveraged, people driven approach to scale my business. And it's a totally different skill set and a totally different structure. Because you're good over here doesn't mean you're good over here and in fact
[00:10:17] Speaker A: probably means you're not good over there.
[00:10:19] Speaker B: I would say 90% of agents are dog shit as team leaders. Like, it's just not the same thing. And acknowledging that I think is, is important doesn't mean that you can't build a really successful business. It just means that it's probably not going to look like what we're talking about today.
[00:10:35] Speaker A: And you've kind, you've broken out like the traditional team rainmaker model. And then when I had met with you, you had broken it out to a few different structures. Do you want to talk about that a little bit or kind of your thought process theories on what the different teams, groups look like?
[00:10:51] Speaker B: I think that what's beautiful about the industry right now is that agents have so much opportunity and I'll, I'll, I'll back that up to say I'm really proud to be an agent. You don't need even a high school degree to get into this industry and you can go make millions, if not hundreds of millions of dollars. Now you have Ben Kinney, who's a real estate agent, who's now worth a billion plus. That says something to people like me who grew up in a very humble household. It's here's what's possible if you just go do the job.
And so when it comes to team building, I got really excited watching one of my mentors build the largest, most successful team by unit count in California. And so I think the traditional playbook has been your rainmaker model. You got somebody's name on the sign who is building the systems and more or less driving production opportunity to the rest of the team. Those are usually I Think higher, higher margin models because the splits for the agents under the rainmaker are typically more favorable to the team. I think you've also got, you know, kind of your, your mentor model and even your brokerage model that have continued to evolve as social media has taken root. And candidly as, as cloud brokerages have given agents a lot more flexibility both financially and in terms of what they can go go build themselves. And at the end of the day, I love anything that puts the agents in more control over their own destiny. I love that we've kind gone away from you. Remember, remember C21, the gold coats, right? That was the status symbol. And I remember I watched people, I'm like that dude's got a gold coat. She's a badass. That's who I wanted to be. And now it's like the brokerage I think is secondary. I really think it's agent centric. And so when it comes to team building there's so many different ways that you can do it. I think that a lot of teams are starting to leverage the ability to bring agents in from different territories. So you got, you know, a mentor or brokerage model that allows you to expand geographically and deliver different types of value that aren't just production based. I think that what you're going to continue to see is the, the I guess power and value of the agent and the brokerage. Power and value really becoming secondary because teams I think are going to start to look a little bit more like brokerages. They can scale just as quickly. And I do think there's like, there's a sentiment, right, I think where agents, especially younger agents, feel like joining a team is a huge advantage. And maybe I'm wrong in that, but I think a common sentiment that we're hearing is I can get better, better traction and close more deals if I go join a team. And so in that sense I think the teams are becoming more valuable than the brokerages.
[00:13:42] Speaker A: There are many brokerages and I think the brokerages, I mean because you think back to probably when we first started, it wasn't the brokerages were not built out to really support teams. It wasn't something that they wanted happening. And over the last 15 years a lot of them, if not most of them need to have some sort of structure in place to support a rainmaker, a team lead, someone that wants to build that out and are a lot more open to it. And I think that's what has to happen for a brokerage to survive.
[00:14:12] Speaker C: Now Ray, in perspective, how long have
[00:14:14] Speaker B: you been an agent this 13 years.
[00:14:16] Speaker A: Well, I forgot to mention he was realtor of the year 2024. I should have said that in your intro. 25. Anyways, okay, yeah, 13 years.
[00:14:26] Speaker C: Because talking about the gold coats, I'm like, okay, you've. You've been doing this for a long time. That was way before I was ever in real estate, but I remember those gold coats.
[00:14:33] Speaker B: Yeah, Great branding, right? And I think it was like, that was peak brokerage life. You know what I mean?
[00:14:42] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah.
[00:14:42] Speaker B: I think that was, like, as good as it got for the brokerage system, and I love that. Now you're seeing brokerages really acknowledge and understand.
I have to, you know, more or less, like, get out of the way of my agents seizing more opportunity, because if I don't, they'll go find it elsewhere. I really like that. Brokerages, Shannon, to exactly what you said, they're finding ways to support the entrepreneurial spirit with real estate agents.
[00:15:10] Speaker C: And that's something that we're focused on in all of you. And when Shannon and I meet, it's how do we provide the resources that allow agents to meet and reach their goals? And it's difficult, right, because there's so much out there, and you have to be true to yourself, true to the brokerage, and figuring out what value you can and want to provide. Because you can't be everything to everybody, especially when you have as many big personalities as the real estate industry does. If you try to please every agent, you're going to go nuts and probably broke.
[00:15:36] Speaker B: Yeah, that's so well said. At one point in my career, I was asking myself, how do we just do everything? And then we realized that is a fool's errand and a losing game. It's how do we do the thing that we love to do better than anybody else and do it well? That's a question that we ask ourselves every day. And, guys, the craziest shit is that it changes so much.
AI, 12 months ago was something that I'm like, yeah, we'll see. I can't live without it now. It's crazy how fast that value is changing.
[00:16:07] Speaker A: Yeah. Who's adapting? What about. So we have, like, the traditional rainmaker model, and that's what we see. A lot of these longtime brokerages have kind of built structures around that. But then you have. You don't follow that model at Coastline, right? What are you doing?
[00:16:21] Speaker B: So I. I define three different models, and then within that, there's a ton of different variations. Right. I think you got the rainmaker model again, your Traditional setup. That's what a lot of the OG teams are still running. And you could picture it, right, if it says somebody's name on a sign and they have agents working with them. That's what I'm talking about. Then you have what I consider to be the mentor model that is more resource and access driven. Right. That the people on the team are really joining a community that provides access to training, education, resources, culture, and typically. Yeah, culture, right. I think that word is just so bastardized. I try to be really careful using the word culture, but that's it. I think agents really do love that sense of community. I think most of us are very people driven. And so the mentor model I think checks that box. And there's some caveats to it. I think if you're going to run that model as the head, your production is certainly limited because you're going to be pulled in different directions, providing that access and your margins might be a little bit tighter because you're not necessarily driving the team production. You're helping the team get into higher levels of production. And so you might not have the most favorable brokerage or team split. And then the third model that I think you're seeing pop up and you talk about some of the largest, you know, highest unit count, highest volume teams in the country. They're running what I consider to be the brokerage model, which is taking all of the things that a brokerage should offer and moving it over to a team unified structure, branding and culture. And I think that that model is really what you're going to continue to see shape a lot of the industry as teams get bigger, as the people running those teams gain more influence and power in the industry. I think a lot of people are going to look at that and say, I want to go this direction. I have the ability to go do what, you know, the, the large scale brokerages maybe can't do anymore because the, the cultural disparity is so big. I'm gonna go scale this in my own way myself. And I mean, we switched brokerages after being with our former brokerage after 10 years. And a large part of that was I want to go do things my own way and build a platform on the things that I really consider valuable. And I can't be handcuffed to do that. And I think that now there's a ton of opportunity, whether it's going independent or joining one of these cloud platforms, to go say, I'm going to build this my own way and there's nothing holding me back anymore. I don't have to have my coat be a certain color. I don't have to have a specific color scheme or a logo on my sign. And it speaks to what I'm really excited about. Agents are taking control of the industry and I think that's fantastic.
[00:19:06] Speaker C: But I think brokerages are realizing that and they're letting go of a lot of the power because, you know, you had agents walking away and high value agents, you see, you know, compass, you see a lot of these. I have friends who are on teams, team leads, groups, and literally have no idea what brokerage they're a part of. I know they're not brokers, but I can't find anything about their brokerage until I ask or look them up on the dre. And there's just no branding in sight. And the brokerage is okay with that because they're producing and it's better than nothing.
[00:19:34] Speaker A: Yeah. Like there's one specific brokerage that is their entire model. Like, you do not see their name, name ever. And all of their agents are all of their own what people perceive as brokerages. And then they're just behind the scenes.
[00:19:46] Speaker B: I know who you're talking about. And what I love is like they position themselves. I don't. Pretty early on, inwardly they call themselves a brokerage, but externally, because I had a chance to meet with them as we were figuring out what we were going to do. It's a platform. Tap into our platform and we'll let you do it the way that you want.
[00:20:04] Speaker A: And I think that's their name.
[00:20:06] Speaker B: Yeah, it's fascinating how, and I, I mean, when did that change? It can't have been more than 10 years ago.
[00:20:12] Speaker A: Like kind of tapping back to just how quickly things have changed. And Daniel and I was that yesterday. When did I see you? Monday, two days ago. We were kind of chatting. A lot of this stuff that these long term brokerages have built out. You know, it's hundreds of thousands of dollars and they're building from scratch these tech stacks and everything. It's so much easier today to do that. So it's kind of devaluing that and then making it easier for others if you can tap into the right tools. And I don't know if that's scary or exciting or any of it, but it's just a huge change in general and I think that's going to start shaping.
[00:20:46] Speaker C: Speaking about the progression of AI Ray between 12 months and now, if you're at all into like vibe coding and those platforms like the V0 OpenClaw you could literally build out your own CRM. You could build out your own tech stack in the matter of days with 20, 30 bucks where it would cost Berkshire Hathaway a few million dollars to build out in the past. It's a different world.
[00:21:11] Speaker B: I'm excited about it too. I know a lot of people are terrified. I was in a council meeting with our local association and somebody asked about AI and they said, you can be scared of it or you can see it as an opportunity.
Or they asked, is it something that scares you or is it an opportunity? And somebody said, both. And I respectfully disagree. Like, unequivocally, if you think it's scary, it is and you're missing the opportunity. But if you just say, I'm not going to be afraid of this at all, and I'm going to go embrace it, the opportunity is massive. I haven't heard of V0 just took a note and you can bet your ass right after this meeting, that's the first thing I'm looking into because I'm not afraid of what it can do. I'm looking at how do I now leverage this as an opportunity to grow.
[00:21:58] Speaker C: So to be clear, I am very afraid of what AI could do. We all giggle and laugh now, but when we're in Skynet in a few years, all like running for our lives as the machines are trying to kill us, remember this moment. So while, yeah, it's awesome, eventually you'll get to a point when you have people like Elon Musk saying, hey, there's real risk here, like, we should listen or not.
[00:22:18] Speaker B: I want to be that person.
[00:22:19] Speaker C: That's a whole different topic.
[00:22:20] Speaker B: Like when the robots take over, they remember me as, like, you were cool. All right, man, you embraced.
[00:22:29] Speaker C: You're going to be sent to the nice prison camp.
[00:22:30] Speaker B: There you go. Yeah, yeah. We get snacks, we get snacks.
[00:22:34] Speaker A: We get snacks in there.
All the snacks with all of this. And I'm thinking like, we, we've been in the industry for a while, we're kind of more on the back end of how do we build out groups, teams, how do we support agents? What about the newer agents that are getting into the industry that are thinking, do I join a team or is that the best move? Kind of, what's your conversation with those agents in guiding them to what are you looking for? And this is the type of lead you should be looking for because at the brokerage you were at before, was it all the same team structure and you people replaced personality wise, or were there different structures?
[00:23:12] Speaker B: Definitely different Structures. But I think, to answer your question, I think that you kind of hit the nail on the head. It's really understanding, like, what is the agent looking for? What does that agent consider valuable? Because what we've, we've kind of alluded to is like, there's so many ways to do this and you can't do everything. You've got to do the thing that you are passionate about really, really well. And then as agents go look around, they'll find the things that they consider valuable and hopefully latch onto that. I think that one of the things that we did later than we should have, if I'm being really honest, is like, identify our perfect agent avatar who's the perfect agent that we can trust to tap into our platform that will go get results. And it's not somebody, if I'm being really honest about just my setup, it's not somebody that wants to go do their own thing. We are pretty structured with our systems. It's not somebody that is really adamant about having their name out there predominantly on the for sale signs. We have a very specific marketing set of standards that allow us to scale. We go do X, Y, Z on your behalf because it's stylized and systemized. I think early on when we were first starting to get our feet under us, it was just like, let's bring anybody that's cool. And now we've taken a step back and we've said, you have to be cool, but you also have to abide by our standards. Because, you know, I was one of those people that says if you back off your standards, you have none. And then I backed off of them. And I was like, this doesn't, this doesn't feel good.
This doesn't give me confidence that we're going to be able to grow. And so we really got rigid and said, if you're going to be a part of this ecosystem, you have to do XYZ the way that we all do it. And if not, that doesn't mean you're a bad agent. That means I hate you when you're wrong.
[00:25:02] Speaker A: I don't want to ever see you again.
[00:25:04] Speaker B: There's so many other options out there. This just isn't the one for you. That's not. It's not bad.
[00:25:09] Speaker A: It's in your best interest to look elsewhere.
[00:25:12] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:25:12] Speaker C: When Shannon and I first started talking about working together a long time ago, we were in San Diego. We had just acquired a company in San Diego. We were driving around a bunch of properties and we referenced nervous about whatever you're about to say as what? We don't want to be like that. Hyperscale and hyperscale into bankruptcy. But when you look at that, when you're building out this group, this team, this brokerage, whatever it might be, you have to look at the finances. You know, you can't have an exp model while having brick and mortar and providing all these other things. It has to be led by the finances. Unless you're private equity backed and you have a few hundred million dollars to burn, you have to be led by the finances, the culture, regardless of the stigma around that word. And you have to fit and value what is being provided. Otherwise, you know, it doesn't work. And those, you know, agent humans have seasons in their lives. The what the new agent values isn't necessarily what that same agent is going to value 10 years into their career. And, you know, agents move, it's okay to your point, they suck and they're wrong. But you got to determine who you are, who, who works well with you, what your unique value proposition is, and own it, move forward with it, and not go bankrupt.
[00:26:21] Speaker B: I think a lot of people get into team building thinking they're going to make more money. And it's a, it's a way to lose a lot of money really fast. If you don't know what you're doing
[00:26:30] Speaker A: and even if you're losing the time that's allowing you to make money that you would have been making, you're screwed.
[00:26:35] Speaker D: And you also have to decide, is this what you really want to do? Because you're no longer, you know, that rainmaker. Now you're the coach. You're.
You're helping everyone else build their businesses. And it's not for everybody.
[00:26:46] Speaker B: I think what a lot of people don't understand it. Like, you can systemize this in a way where you have a predictable floor. I think that was the biggest. Aha. Is like, I can now predictably say we're going to close X amount of deals every month and make X amount of money. And I feel really confident in that. But I think the hardest thing that people still need to realize is getting started. Your floor is zero. Your floor is maybe actually less than zero because you have expenses when you go start a team. And the difference between a really profitable month in Southern California anyway, the difference between a really profitable month and a month in the red is like one deal. We average 20, 30, $40,000 in commission.
That's profit some months. You know what I mean? So it can go really fast where you're on top of the world, thinking you're going to have an incredibly profitable quarter. And then the next quarter, you're writing checks to stay open. It can move really quickly, especially getting started.
[00:27:40] Speaker D: And you have that overhead that you can't just cut.
[00:27:43] Speaker B: And overhead grows quick, man. It sneaks up on you like crazy. All of a sudden, you're looking at P. Ls. You're like, we're killing it. And then you're like, where did XYZ expense come from? And it. You have to. You've got to account for that.
[00:27:57] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:27:57] Speaker B: How often are you guys looking at P. Ls? This is a discussion that I have with so many.
[00:28:01] Speaker A: Daniel. Probably every morning.
[00:28:03] Speaker D: Every day?
[00:28:03] Speaker B: Yeah, every day.
[00:28:04] Speaker D: Well, within our operation where, you know, it's not as simple as just the transactions on the brokerage side, we have a lot of moving parts throughout our different divisions, different companies. So, yeah, if we don't keep track of the P and L closely, it could get real dangerous real quick.
[00:28:21] Speaker B: I'd love to get your thoughts. I've told team builders and business owners, like, the best thing that you can do from a skill standpoint is get really good at reading and understanding P and ls.
[00:28:30] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:28:30] Speaker B: And it's the most tedious, boring shit that you can do.
[00:28:33] Speaker D: I like it. I think you.
[00:28:35] Speaker A: If you. I do not.
[00:28:37] Speaker C: If you don't have some.
[00:28:37] Speaker D: If you don't like it, you find someone who does. Because the people who love. Who like it, love it. And they'll be able to help you with that.
[00:28:43] Speaker B: Yeah, I think start. If you're starting a team, the first thing that you need to do is shore up finances. I thought for a long time, like, I would just run my own QuickBooks, and then I'd get, you know, to December, and I'm like, I need somebody to clean up all of my books. The best decision I think we ever made was hiring a bookkeeper. It was like, I'm not gonna do this anymore. You do it.
[00:29:04] Speaker A: So you built out your structure. You got ahead of the finances. What would you say the hardest part of running a group? Having a brokerage, whatever it looks like. What is the hardest part of all of that? Both expected and unexpected.
[00:29:16] Speaker B: I got asked this question a lot, and I wish I had a better answer, but I'll give you kind of like twofold. The hardest part is, is all of it. There's so much shit going on at any given time. You don't have one job anymore. It's not. You know, when I was just an agent, my job was Go find the next deal. That's not my job anymore. It's find the next deal, make sure my agents aren't losing their mind. Make sure that the fires on the transaction are put out. You know, make sure that my assistant and director of operations are doing like there's a million things at any given time that have to get done. My job is not necessarily to do them, it's just to make sure they get done. But managing that, it's such a different role and it's such a different hat that I have to wear on a consistent basis. That adjustment doesn't happen overnight. That is something that I'm still trying to figure out how to be better at every day. So the hardest part, honestly, I think is all of it. And then second to that is turning off. I think that the thing that I struggle with, with a family, right, it's that balance that is so hard some days. And my coach told me recently the most valuable thing is not time, it's attention.
Because I can be with my family. But my mind was on work for a long time. And the only time I was actually off was when we were on vacation. Like, when I'm on vacation, I'm not working. Emails are done. Phone for the most part's on silent, but I could be at home having dinner, thinking about P. Ls or thinking about that next agent attraction meeting. Like, it's really hard to turn off and getting better at that and recognizing that that balance has to be. There has been a huge change in my daily workload, how I structure the daily routines of my business. Because if I don't prioritize the family and the things that I really enjoy, what the fuck am I building this for? Like, what's the point?
[00:31:00] Speaker A: What is this even for? I have those moments like, why? Why am I doing this, Ray?
[00:31:05] Speaker D: Are you still doing deals?
[00:31:06] Speaker B: I'm still in production.
[00:31:07] Speaker D: Yeah. So if you're doing deals and running a company, there's no time that's yours anymore. And that's super, super difficult.
[00:31:15] Speaker A: Yeah, well, and it's just kind of knowing a little, a little of your personality too. It's like you can move as slow as you want to move, but if you have end goals in mind, all of that, if you're not doing it, it's not happening. Right. So there's an excitement to. To continue and use that dead time. I was a little embarrassed for us, Daniel, at that lunch when they were asking everyone what their hobbies were and like, immediately, like, I was, I thought work and then But I didn't. No one asked me. And then they asked you, like, daniel, what's your hobby? And you're like, work. And I'm like, I can't tell if that's good or bad, but it's the truth. Yeah. Like, it's. If you give me a Saturday with no interruptions, I'm like, hell, yeah. Let's get in the office and crank out all of the things that I've been thinking about and haven't been able to do, and that's genuinely what I want to be doing.
[00:31:58] Speaker C: So I remember when I was still
[00:31:59] Speaker D: in grad school, I was living at the beach with a bunch of guys, and one of my still really good buddies goes, you need to find some hobbies. Like, you work too much. It's like, work, school and work school. And he's like, you need to find some hobbies. So I went. I started doing a bunch of random stuff like sailing classes, tennis, like, all these random things. And a few months later, he comes back and goes, just stop.
[00:32:20] Speaker C: Your hobbies, work.
[00:32:21] Speaker D: And that's okay. Don't try to do other things.
I own it, but I like it.
[00:32:27] Speaker B: It's a gift and a curse, right? Because it's such a privilege to be able to say, we love what we do. I truly love what I do. I love the building aspect of it. But the curse is like, I mean, how many. How many times have you been asked, like, what is enough?
[00:32:40] Speaker A: Look like, you know, it's never enough. There's no end in sight.
[00:32:43] Speaker B: I don't have a good answer. I really don't. By the time I get this thing where I want it to be, my mind is probably already 10 steps into the next thing. I think the thing that I'm just really passionate about is, like, when I'm off, I don't ever have to worry about turning on, just training myself to be off more. But I love to do that. I love this thing, man. I love what I do. And Shannon, like, my idea of a good Saturday is quiet, and I'm in. I got nobody bothering me, and I get to just focus on build.
[00:33:11] Speaker A: Maybe a little snack. And then you're just in a little snack. Maybe a little snack. I know Daniel's worked. Been working on. I don't know how well it's going for you, but pausing to, like, you're always in go mode. You're always pushing forward. You're accomplishing the next thing, and then it's just, what's next? What's next? But pausing and looking back and Celebrating what you have actually accomplished and acknowledging in a celebratory way all of those goals you've hit along the way. Like, he does not do that. I try hard to do that. You probably don't do it, Ray.
[00:33:41] Speaker B: No, I mean, Daniel, me and you sound like we're very similar. I had my better half, who's also in the industry, we had an agent open her first escrow. This is years ago. And she's like, oh, we gotta celebrate. I'm like, celebrate what? It hasn't closed yet.
[00:33:54] Speaker A: Like, what?
[00:33:55] Speaker B: Go get. Go get the next. What are we celebrating? And she had to like, check me. She's like, what's big for you is not the same for somebody else. Like, we have to take time to celebrate our people and celebrate our accomplishments because again, like, if we don't, what are we doing this for? What's the point? And it's really hard because, Daniel, just like you, man, I think that you and I are very similar. I'm always thinking about the next five things.
[00:34:18] Speaker D: Yeah, my wife slows me down with that a lot. But also Shannon does a good job as well of texting me and saying, hey, this happened. Like text this person one time. I thought she was talking to the third person. It was confusing. We got to figure it out. But yeah, I need to stop. And I think it's super important, especially as a leader to celebrate your people, celebrate the wins. And there's a lot of science behind it. It's that dopamine hit that will actually help you do more in the long term. It can't just always be the never ending horizon.
[00:34:47] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:34:48] Speaker A: Even though it is. Okay. I think. I mean, I feel like we could talk about a hundred million more things. And Ray, I hope you come back. I know there's a couple topics that I would love your opinion on and I would love to watch Daniel hear your opinion on.
But for now, let's wrap this one up, if you can, with.
At what point do you think an agent should start a team or group? If that's what they're thinking to do? And then do you think every new agent should start in a group or team setting?
[00:35:16] Speaker B: I'm gonna go, no. Every agent should not start in a group setting. I love this industry as it exists in 2026, because agents can do whatever they want. Agents can literally go build billion dollar businesses or they can, you know, build a solo business and buy a bunch of property and retire that way. I love that this industry affords the everyday person the opportunity to go do something really cool and really special without having to, you know, come up with a quarter million dollars in capital out the gate.
That being said, I love team building because it's, I think it's really hard to sell a solo practice. You know, it's really hard to leverage a solo practice with a team, with a brand, with a system and with, you know, a platform behind it that can be leveraged, that can be sold. And so it creates extra. Yeah, yeah. It runs like a, just a very well oiled business. And so I think that we're going to see more agents attempt to build it. Before they do, I really think they should sit down and understand the structure and the systems and the financials they go into doing it. Because the difference with any business, the difference between success and failure is it's a fine line, it's really, really small margin.
[00:36:24] Speaker A: And the more no such thing as failure. That's what Daniel says.
[00:36:27] Speaker B: Fair enough. Right. It's just getting up and failure to do it again.
[00:36:31] Speaker A: Failure is not an option. That's what you say. Yeah.
[00:36:33] Speaker B: And I think the ones that succeed, they, you know, they do what it takes. I say it all the time. I'm not the smartest dude that you'll meet. I'm, I'm certainly, you know, not the tallest or the most privileged. But like I work, I like working. I work my tail off to get to where I'm at. But I also, the thing that I've done well, that I think a lot of agents would be well served to do is I've forced myself just like now to get in rooms with people that I can go learn from, to go figure out what they did well before I go fall on my face. And so I've been adamant every time I've taken on a new adventure or embarked on a new journey, find who has done what I want to do and go steal time from them. Fifteen minutes over a cup of coffee has changed my life because the people that I've had coffee with have put me on this path. I think that's the best thing that you can do if you're looking to start a team.
[00:37:20] Speaker A: And that's my beauty of my friendship with both of you. There's always a nugget every time we have a conversation. I always walk away with some sort of new thought process and then spin in my head for the next week and change everything I want to do. But you're right. Be around the right people, learn from people, and don't ever stop doing that.
[00:37:38] Speaker D: Ray, I have a question. What's your favorite book.
[00:37:40] Speaker B: It's probably hundred million dollar leads. I really am into Alex Hermosi. That's probably my one right now. I would say like generally speaking, rich dad, poor dad.
[00:37:51] Speaker C: Oh yeah.
[00:37:53] Speaker B: I think what, what's in that book is so simple today because I think those concepts are pretty widely understood.
But it was, I think articulated in a way where Robert Kiyosaki said what I thought in my head and brought a lot of validity to those thoughts. And I was like, I can do this. And I think that was, that was a really powerful experience for me. What about yours? Because whatever you're reading, I want to make sure I absorb.
[00:38:20] Speaker A: Yeah. What are you reading right now?
[00:38:21] Speaker C: I read a lot. Like I'll do a book a week
[00:38:23] Speaker D: but one of the things that you said is like in regards to the nugget. So there's a book, it's the. Oh my gosh. And I'm breaking the almanac of Raval Naval something. I'm going to butcher his last name. But it's a book that was written taking excerpts of his tweets, his blogs, his interviews and they put it into a book that's just one of the most fascinating books.
Psychology, business, philosophy, it's incredible. But it's not an actual book. It's just excerpts from what this guy has said over a period of 10 plus years. They put it into a book and it was life changing. I'll send it over to you. But it's one of those things where it's just a book full of nuggets, full of treats.
[00:39:04] Speaker B: It's funny how the kind of books that I've read have evolved over time. Big Patrick Lencioni, I like how he does a lot of like anecdotal messages in his business building books, but something like this where it's like I'm just gonna do compilation of cool ideas in the mold of like $100 million leads. I really like that because in every chapter there's a new nugget. It's not this overarching thing. It's like, take this piece.
[00:39:29] Speaker A: When are you coming back, Ray?
[00:39:30] Speaker B: You tell me. This has been such a treat just to be able to talk to two like minded professionals and share some insights. I've got a couple notes of things that I'm going to go implement. So anytime you give me the opportunity to steal some time off of your calendar, I'm jumping same.
[00:39:48] Speaker A: I want to do clear cooperation next.
[00:39:50] Speaker B: Yeah, I've got so many thoughts. That's one where we're gonna have a lot of bleeps. I got a lot of thoughts.
[00:39:57] Speaker A: A lot of editing. Oh, my gosh. Well, we appreciate you so much. I'm so happy that you joined us for this. You do a lot of content that's helpful, educational, funny.
[00:40:07] Speaker B: Thank you very much. Yeah, love that link.
[00:40:09] Speaker A: All that for everyone else, like and subscribe. How many followers are we at?
[00:40:13] Speaker B: 12, 113. I'll get my mom on there.
[00:40:17] Speaker A: Yeah, I need to make sure my mom's following, but we appreciate you. Thank you so much.
[00:40:23] Speaker B: Thank you guys for having me. Really appreciate it. We'll see you soon. Bye.
[00:40:26] Speaker A: That's a wrap on this episode of AllView360, all things real estate. If you found this helpful, don't forget to subscribe, leave a review and share it with someone navigating their own real estate journey. Connect with us anytime on Instagram @AllView360 and on LinkedIn @AllView Real Estate. Until next time, stay curious and keep your perspective. 360.
